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Solidworks / brain washing

The one big thing you can do with OTF you can't do with groups is keep your feature count low by eliminating superfluous daum-planes.



Imagine if you can the advantages of low feature count and fewer datum-planes:



smaller models.



faster regen.



easier troubleshoot. (fewer features to t/s).



fewer features to fail.



less to go wrong.



smaller learning curve on unfamiliar models (even familiar models).



easier feature redefine.



no groups to screw with. (if you had a redefine that requires an additional feature to be added to a group what needs to be done ? Pattern has to be deleted, group has to be ungrouped and regrouped to include the additional feature and finally repatterned)



Easier selectability of datum-planes.



Less eye strain trying to find the plane you want to use.



I gotta say that make-datum is less troublesome than grouping (just my opinion).
 
Low feature count does not mean smaller model or faster regen. Thes are based on geometric calculations. And no matter how you create datums they still have to regenerate. I think it is easier to troubleshoot if you can isolate features. The same goes for the learing curve, it is much easier to understand a model when you can see it step by step in the model tree and model player. I agree that it is a pain to delete patterns, but only because of the drawing details that may be affected. As far as having to ungroup the features, you can simply redefine the group to include the new feature. And you would have to do the same if you added OTF datums that affect the pattern/group.
 
The faster regen bit is debatable, but if I only have to research 200 features in a model as opposed to 400, I'm going to get up to speed on the 200 feature model faster than the 400 one - QED.



I was also taught how to use make datum but was never told not to use it..



Also, can you use ref pattern on patterned groups ??
 
Your right about having more features to sort through. But if they are grouped together then they are easy to work with and understand.

Yes you can ref pattern patterned groups. But like any ref pattern in Pro it doesn't always work. Some times even with ungrouped features ref patterns fail for no apparent reason. So I try to group features before I pattern.
 
I was just thinking. What if in Wildfire you copy a feature from a model created in 2001 with make datums. Will the make datums be converted to a group, or will Pro leave them in the feature. If it works you could use an old part to copy features from, and continue to use make datums in Wildfire simply by copying features.

Someone with Wildfire and files created in rev 2001 or earlier please test this, and tell me if it works!
 
Wildfire does not change them to groups, they are still in feature as they should be. I think creating OTF features in 2001 and copying them to Wildfire would be a total waste of time and inefficient.
 
OTF is one of those obscure concepts that new users can have some difficulty in wrapping their brains around and requires some lateral thinking. Once the basic, underlying concept is understood it is an extremely valuable tool.



OTF is functionality that Pro/E possesses that the competition does not. They should be expanding it and marketing it to help get their market share back, not getting rid of it.



One of Pro/E's strengths is the range of reference geometry it has available and this detracts from that.



Is there some new, obscure config.pro option in Bilge Water that controls make-datums ??
 
Ok, I have both Pro/E 2001 and Solidworks 2001 and guess what I can do the same things in both programs. Sometimes the method of creation is similiar and sometimes it is very different.



And some things I can do easier in solidworks and some thing I can do easier in Pro/E it all depends. Overall I find the making of planes and other reference geo. about the same in both programs.
 
Try creating datum-points or putting a plane thru a pair of parallel axes or a plane normal to an axis in SW.



Would also list make-datum but PTC has just shot themselves in the foot with this one..
 
One of the places I use datums on the fly the most is when assembling a rotating part to an assembly. I orient the part to a DOTF that runs through the axis of rotation and is at an angle to another plane. Now if I want to change the assembled angle I just select the part using Mod Assem and voila, the dimension I need is there ready for changing. This is great for checking for interferences on a moving part.



If I were to do this without DOTF I'd either have to turn on the datums and try and pick through the thousands that appear to find the right one to change or I'd have to scroll through the Model Tree to find the right datum.



When I want to change the assembly of a part, I want to pick the part and make the change. Where is the logic in picking a datum plane?



With datums on the fly, my models are cleaner without extraneous datum planes obscuring my view or my thinking.
 
they are not going to yank Wildfire off the shelves.... lets be realistic here.



one thing i've found by talking to development engineers at PTC is that they are very unwilling to change Wildfire. they think all the so called development they did was the only way to make the product.



maybe they will change this if enough people complain. let me give an example: if you still have your Pre-Production release of Wildfire, note that the Spin function was very strange compared to previous releases. in production versions of Wildfire, they changed the spin engine back to the familiar old method because too many people (myself included) voiced their opinions.



i recommend that if you truly hate the lack of DOTF, get in touch with a PTC rep and voice your opinion.
 
It's an even sadder day, with attitudes like this Pro/E needs to be added to the endangered species list..
 
hi all iam also a user of proe and solidworks the datum creation in solid is a big problem added to that there is another big problem in solidworks which is it does not allow u to create a feature which is not intersecting the existing geomentry what is your comment in this issue.Did u all find this as a problem or not?
 
How does CATIA do the datum thing? A CATIA user friend expressed shock when he saw the datums turned on in Pro/E. (I had not discovered the ture virtues of make datums at the time)



Thhe same question applies to IDEAS?



Sam
 
Isn't it a tragedy, they've been in Pro/E for as long as I can remember.



It used to be that you couldn't use make-datum during a redefine, it took them to R20 (maybe R18) to fix this.
 
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