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Pro-E / PTC sucks

megaladon said:
My 2 cents... i've noticed in here that the people complaining about pro/e have very few posts to their name. my assumption is they are new and don't like the taste of broccoli even though it's good for them.
Click to expand...


Talk about hitting the nail on the head!!!!
 
Matt Raby checking in here. Yes, I was new to PRO when I started this topic almost 5 years ago. I need to vent my frustration with the difficulty of using /learning PRO. I have gotten to know itand can use it.


I love broccoli and all other vegetables.


PRO still sucks. I don't need it's "powerful" features. I need to model assemblies, build 'em and get the job out the door. Solidworks still blows it out of the water in this respect and I recently bought two seats. I find it to be a great coincedence that this forum is revived at about the same time I'm getting away from this dread beast. It's nice closure...
smiley32.gif
 
Yes... it is because I am not proficient. It is completely my fault that PRO/E sucks.


Now that your assumtion about me is confirmed, can you confirm that you are a complete asshole?
 
Wow, defensive too. I have been called much worse and you can think what you want, because no one can change that. If being a proficient Pro/E user and owning up to my short comings makes me an a**hole than I can confirm your assumptions.
 
I am defensive, once again your superior intellect has detected a flaw in others. Bravo! I've alway admired people who like to insult others when they are not face to face. I also am suspect of anyone whose alias includes words like "super" and "large". What are you making up for?


FYI, I did gain profiencency in Pro. I've been running an engineering/automation firm on it for 5 years. I still think that is not the right software for my needs. Refer back to the first few posts in this thread...they still hold true.
 
Yes,I like to insult others because I am the one who is calling people names...<?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" />


Oh... the name... it was my CB handle in High School because I drove a Ford Superduty. Curent truck is too, and probably my next will be.


In my experience it is those people that accuse people of making up for something, that have something to make up for.
 
Hi,


Just to be better informed I would like to ask you a favor.
Can you give some examples where SolidWorks does a better / easier job in e.g. assemblies than Pro/E ?
No pun intented.
I hear so much about Pro/E versus SolidWorks but most of the time the arguments are very black/white or very vague.
I'm interested to know whether SolidWorks is indeed better or not.


Thank you in advance.


Best regards,


John Bijnens
 
Assemblies are MUCH easier in SolidWorks. Simply tile the windows and drag a part from one window into the assembly. You can also drag parts from the model tree of an assembly in one window into an assembly in another window - or a subassembly in the same window. Yeah, you can crtl-select a series of parts too. Gosh, you can even do this with features! SW has had this functionality for at least a decade. I'm going to guess that all of the leading Windows-based MCAD systems do this (Inventor, Solid Edge, etc.).


Another very useful part and assembly functionality in SW is the ability to create non-uniform hole patterns using the Hole Wizard (the Hole Tool in Pro/E is a very poor copy of this). Aset of holes can be created in any arrangement in a single feature. But it gets better: thisset of holes can be easily populated with components at the assembly level.


Pro/E WF3 has none of this capability: it's all still menu-based, or it just doesn't have it at all. I don't know if any ofthese simple but highly productive functionalities have been added to later versions of Pro/E.


There is no need to do all this grouping crap that is embedded in Pro/E. In SW, simply ctrl-select components or features and do what you want with them: SW recognizes that you are grouping them. And you can eliminate or add to these groups without any need to recompile them.


Muliple configurations are a snap: none of the garbage involving instances, constantly regeneration or multiple assembly files that bog down Pro/E.


These are just a few of the basic functionality tools that SW has had for years, where they looked at user workflow to build productivity into their product. The time savings for me are certainly well into the hundreds of hours, perhaps even thousands of hours.
 
Hm.


I must admit I'm a bit disappointed by the feature list you give.


The dragging from the model tree is indeed something that can't be done in Pro/E, however it is possible to drag it from an "in session" window into an arbitrary assembly.


I don't understand what you're meaning with non-uniform hole patterns.
I thought Pro/E could do this very easily e.g. pattern by table, or by clicking/unclicking pattern members.
Also the set of holes can be easily populated with components at the assembly level (= pattern by reference).
Also copy/paste is now supported in Pro/E (I'm working with Creo WF5).


Since WF3 things have evolved. In WF5 many things are now more SolidWorks like you could say.


In order to end this list of SolidWorks can do this and Pro/E can this also and vice versa there is one thing you should consider.
Pro/E is older than SolidWorks and had an established user base.
In the days Pro/E started Windows wasn't what it is today nor was the PC hardware. So the decision to develop on Unix was defendable.
SolidWorks started when PC's were more or less a match for their Unix counterparts so they were able to start from scratch in Windows.
The fact that PTC kept its 'ugly' menu structures so long is not that they were so stubborn that they didn't notice the advantages of the Windows way of working but they were not able to do that because of their installed user base.
Image what would have happened if they changed the user interface from one day to another from the menu structure to the SolidWorks interface. Much customization work users had done would be useless, not mentioning the fact that those users had to change their way of working drastically.
For a new user this would be a great thing but I'm not convinced it would have been that way for long time users.

PTC has choosen to change the user interface gradually. Within one or two releases they will be in par with the way SolidWork or Inventor works.

Thanks for being so kind as to answer my question. I've now a better idea.

Best regards,


John Bijnens
 
Mindripper said:
Assemblies are MUCH easier in SolidWorks. Simply tile the windows and drag a part from one window into the assembly. You can also drag parts from the model tree of an assembly in one window into an assembly in another window - or a subassembly in the same window. Yeah, you can crtl-select a series of parts too. Gosh, you can even do this with features! SW has had this functionality for at least a decade. I'm going to guess that all of the leading Windows-based MCAD systems do this (Inventor, Solid Edge, etc.).


Another very useful part and assembly functionality in SW is the ability to create non-uniform hole patterns using the Hole Wizard (the Hole Tool in Pro/E is a very poor copy of this). Aset of holes can be created in any arrangement in a single feature. But it gets better: thisset of holes can be easily populated with components at the assembly level.


Pro/E WF3 has none of this capability: it's all still menu-based, or it just doesn't have it at all. I don't know if any ofthese simple but highly productive functionalities have been added to later versions of Pro/E.


There is no need to do all this grouping crap that is embedded in Pro/E. In SW, simply ctrl-select components or features and do what you want with them: SW recognizes that you are grouping them. And you can eliminate or add to these groups without any need to recompile them.


Muliple configurations are a snap: none of the garbage involving instances, constantly regeneration or multiple assembly files that bog down Pro/E.


These are just a few of the basic functionality tools that SW has had for years, where they looked at user workflow to build productivity into their product. The time savings for me are certainly well into the hundreds of hours, perhaps even thousands of hours.
Click to expand...


Dear Mindripper,


Almost all the features that you mention are available in Proe since many releases other than the first one, which I need to try. I do not wish to say something without trying. But then, I never had the necessisity to pull components from other assemblies. I can always drag them from session, or from my working directory or from any other folder available to me directly into the assembly.


As for other points it would be too much of a verbose reply instead I suggest you take a Training course on Proe to make more authentic comments. Your observations are grossly incorrect.


I do not comment on Solidworks since I do not know the software. I intend to take a training since I hear a lot about it.
 
I'm afraid not srinivasaniyeri: I don't know what version of Pro/E you are running, but none of what I described works in Pro/E WF3 (with Intralink) or any previous version that I have used. No drag and drop from the feature tree (or anywhere else), no tiling of windows, and grouping is still enforced with the Nazi boots that are a trademark of PTC. While I am sure there are things I don't know about Pro/E, I am hardly an inexperienced user. I started using Pro/E in 1997, with Release 17. I have completed a long list of training courses in Pro/E (including a series of refresher courses in WF2 on PTCU when I started using Pro/E again about four years ago), and have at least7,000 hours of 'tube time' as a Pro/E user.
 
Drag and drop does work although not exactly as you're refering to.
Files can be dragged and dropped into the graphics area from the
browser window.
 
first, most of us have to use what we are given....


second, 90% of what we do can be done with just about any cad system,and if you have a problem with that, remember, it wasn't to long ago that everything you see all around you from planes, cars, and bridges, were all designed with paper and pencil.


second, all the salesmen suck!


Gary
Edited by: garymig
 
I don't recall any mention of using 'drag and drop' in the PTCU WF2 training courses I completed a few years ago. 'Drag and drop' definitely does not work from the model tree in WF3. Perhaps 'drag and drop' from a folder doesn't work for me because I'm running Intra/Link 3.4: anything involving files outside the workspace is strongly discouraged, so I wouldn't even attempt to drag a file from a Windows Explorer window (or any browser) into the Pro/E window.


I started my career using pencil on vellum and ink on Mylar to create drawings: this was one of my big motivators for getting into MCAD/CAE. It isn't a question of being able to do the job, it's about productivity: getting the job done better, faster and with greater ease. Those of us who fail to increase our productivity run a high risk ofbecoming obsolete. I have noticed there are a large number of obsolete engineers out of work these days in my part of the world. They seem to blame everyone but themselves: the economy, younger engineers, offshoring. I think they failed themselves: they didn't keep up with the advance of technology in their discipline, or simply got lazy.
 
I am not sure about Intralink (it has been over 5 years since I have used it), but with PDMLink you can view the commonspace or your workspace through your embedded browser and drag and drop into an assembly or drawing.<?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" />

There are many tools inside of Pro/E similar to those described from SW. One of my favorites is Copy
 
Just used the drawing module in WF5/Creo for the first time. What a hash of interfaces! Why on earth is the standard file/edit menu on the upper right? This looks like a WIP...I guess you can move things around?

Edited by: gristle
 
gristle said:
Just used the drawing module in WF5/Creo for the first time. What a hash of interfaces! Why on earth is the standard file/edit menu on the upper right? This looks like a WIP...I guess you can move things around?
Click to expand...

I'm not a fan of that ribbon implementation, I hope when the "real" CREO is released they switch to the Office 2010 gui framework... BTW you can move the menu there's an option somewhere but can't chek it now, I think I read it somewhere in the forum...

Paolo
 
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