Outsourcing

[cpodom]

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Does anyone have first hand experience with outsourcing Drafting? (offshore, <?:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comffice:smarttags" /><st1:country-region><st1lace>India</st1lace></st1:country-region>, <st1:country-region><st1lace>Pakistan</st1lace></st1:country-region>, <st1:country-region><st1lace>China</st1lace></st1:country-region>)

I would like to hear valid arguments supporting both sides.

 

[looslib]

PIA


It takes a well defined document to describe what is expected on both sides.

 

[deepakbhat_nie]

Hi,


I am from India and I have worked for many overseas project.My suggession is if it is only drafting then dont outsource it unless and until it is a bulk amount.As looslib said you will have to contineously help them with your company standards(atleast for 1 complete set of drawings). After they are convinient with the standards then you dont have to follow them, the quality will be good(So if it is lots of work then goahead else dont).I think the same logic applies everywhere(Around the globe)


Regards,


Deepak Bhat
Edited by: deepakbhat_nie

 

[dougr]

Some of my experiences:
<UL>
<LI>10.5 hour time diff is a pain in the *ss
<LI>There's always a language barrier.
<LI>Only suitable for brainless work like drawing change incorporations where spoon feeding can be done - for new design work no substitute for all being "co-located".
<LI>Can't be used for military stuff.
<LI>Outsourcing is necessary nowadays not for lower costs but because there are not enough qualified people left here..
<LI>Spending on peoples salary is an investment in the community and country these peoplelive and work in - shouldn't we be investing in our own communities ?</LI>[/list]
Edited by: dougr

 

[deepakbhat_nie]

Hi Dougr,


I think you had some really bitter exp in outsourcing. I dont think its really that bad.


Regards,


Deepak Bhat

 

[mgnt8]

<UL>
<LI>Twice the work for1/10 the cost</LI>[/list]

 

[design-engine]

Everything I send to China comes back different. You don't hear a thing then wala. FedEX arives and they changed it in Pro/E. Guess they thought they knew better.

That has happend only twice in 10 years but it makes fora good rant.

 

[dougr]

Hi Dougr,


I think you had some really bitter exp in outsourcing. I dont think its really that bad.


Regards,


Deepak Bhat

Think you mean "realistic experience"....

 

[dougr]

<UL>
<LI>Twice the work for1/10 the cost</LI>[/list]

Is that fact or propaganda ???

 

[deepakbhat_nie]

HI Dougr,


Yeh,I have to call it as "realistic experience" after seeing all the above posts. But I think you have interacted with the wrong people. My suggestion is dont go with the brand name of the company but go with the quality. You have to visit the company personallyand understand their expertise and then outsource(I am sure you would have done that).
It would not have caused you so much of problem if you would have thought of all the options in the begining(Like the time zone diff, quality etc.)
Well I am not justifying any option.


Regards,


Deepak Bhat

 

[mgnt8]

[/QUOTE]


Is that fact or propaganda ???


[/QUOTE]


I guess its more like 1/4 the cost in our case and the distance isn't a big deal because the people we work with do it twice as fast as what we were used to. You are right about military applications. Maybe the big dogs like Boeing get to source whatever they want all over the world but we're strictly limited to domestic sources. Its all skilled work, howeverand its all excellent.

 

[Brian_Adkins]

Topic moved to a more-suitable location

 

[dougr]

Is that fact or propaganda ???


[/QUOTE]


I guess its more like 1/4 the cost in our case and the distance isn't a big deal because the people we work with do it twice as fast as what we were used to. You are right about military applications. Maybe the big dogs like Boeing get to source whatever they want all over the world but we're strictly limited to domestic sources. Its all skilled work, howeverand its all excellent.


[/QUOTE]


What kind of work ?

 

[mgnt8]

What kind of work ?

Mold design & mold making. That's no secret though as I've seen tooling coming from Asia for at least the last 10 years.

 

[design-engine]

There are some mold makers that do keep work in the states. http://www.pdt.com
has done a good job in out preforming Chines Koren and India tooling
venders simply in terms of speed. Float time is 2 weeks minimum
to get the mold to the US so you save there too.

 

[BMD]

Outsourcing. What a topic. I think this is directly tied to 'the global economy'.


A global economy is great for multi-national coorporations and developing countrys... while they are developing. It provides for cheap labor from all over the world. The countries providing the cheap labor now will one day see their jobs outsourced to the next round of developing countries. Some day it will all balance out and work will be placed all around the world. Multi-national coorporations are the biggest proponents of a global economy, along with some misguided polaticians such as Bush and Blair.


The problem is that the logical result of a world economy is that at some point all peoples will have the same standard of living and therefore similar wages. It is not possible for all countries to increase their standard of living to what is currently experienced in North America and Western Europe so our standard of living will drop considerably... not such a great trade off for outsourcing.


Why is it that thedeveloped countries feel the need to be ashamed for their development and successes? I think every country that wants to remain viable needs a little nationalism for self preservation. Why is it that the developing countries and non-developing countries are the only ones to condone nationalism?


Outsourcing may seem good for now, but you are trading your and your children's future for current profits.

 

[mgnt8]

There are some mold makers that do keep work in the states. http://www.pdt.com has done a good job in out preforming Chines Koren and India tooling venders simply in terms of speed. Float time is 2 weeks minimum to get the mold to the US so you save there too.

We've worked with PDT in collaboration with some of our bigger customers. The good news is many of the big dogs are recognizing it's to their & the larger community's advantage to keep tooling domestic. Small & medium sized just can't compete, however & that's who's turning increasingly overseas. I think BMD is right when he says companies always end up chasing cheaper sources. 10 years ago it was Singapore & Taiwan, 10 years from now, who knows, Africa? Mars?
Edited by: mgnt8

 

[bobbailey]

Twice the work at half the cost, but takes four times as long because of time diff and language barrier

 

[dougr]

Outsourcing. What a topic. I think this is directly tied to 'the global economy'.


Outsourcing may seem good for now, but you are trading your and your children's future for current profits.

Bravo..

 

[Roger]

dougr:





You're just so bitter. AND RIGHT ON THE MONEY!





I worked for a small-printer company. The chief engineer said "we are going to Taiwan for the molding tools." I said, "you get what you pay for." "But, we will save $500k" We get the tools to the molding house in MN, who also make tools. Should be good for 100,000 shots or more? 2000 shots and they gauled! MN repaired the tools.


Next project, time for tooling discussion. Bring in the folks from MN. Subject of the other tools comes up (I wonder who). "Taiwan uses J2 steel and no heattreating." (Hmm, why did they gaul(sp)?) "What if we made Tiwan use proper steels and heattreatment?" "Well, then we would be very competative." Waving an imaginary flag, "DA DA DA DA DA DA DA DA!" (To the tuneof the Star Spangled Banner)You get what you pay for, people!!!! There are exceptions, but for the most part...