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wildfire 5.0 drawing dashboard

design-engine

New member
what do you guys think of the new dashboard interface instituted by Microsoft....

PTC adopted this for the Pro/DETAIL interface and I have to admit it's on the annoying side. I've been using proe since 1992 and I don't want to take a look to see what column I'm in before I start to move a dimension around.

comments?
Edited by: design-engine
 
Hate it in MS orifice 2007. You can not modify it! I never need to see mailmerge and 90% of the other garbage that MS insists on putting up, gobbling up valuable screen real estate. I understand orifice 2010 is better, you can customize it.

PTC's implementation is even worse than MS's. I will not be using WF5 specifically for this reason. Horizontal ribbons are moronic on wide screen monitors. Maybe MS & PTC are still stuck on 16" CRT's?
 
design-engine said:
what do you guys think of the new dashboard interface instituted by Microsoft....


comments?

I already commented at length about how BAD the ribbon is in Wildfire. On the plus side it's quite configurable, but what annoys me is that the interface is too "modal", and interferes also with the right mouse button context menu
 
Good topic Bart,

If PTC gave us an option to truly customize it then it would not be that awful. Once again it seems ProE has written itself into a corner m much like it did when deciding on forcing object action only selection methods. ProE is probably the only CAD software that still refuses to allow floating toolbars which can be un-docked and returned by double clicking or dragging them from or to the toolbar areas.

SolidWorks started using the ribbon bar for Command Manager in its 2008 release for Part Assembly ly and drawings, and it allows any icon to be added in to or a custom one to be created. If that were available in ProE it would help out. If they expect CreO to go anywhere and become more widely used they should and hopefully are working on respecting both object action where geometry must selected before invoking a command and icon action where icons can be selected and then select the geometry required.

The WF5 interface has taken many things from other software like the ability to create ellipses that can b e sketched or rotated at an ang le other than 90deg increments. The constraints UI also allows application of a constraint based on selected geometry so you aren't forced to select one type at a time.

I love how PTC is still using its Wildfire 5 adds for CreO. It al so will get quite confusing when the creo direct software installer is co-create.exe

Michael
 
I made the transition from 2000i2 to WF 5.0 and the drawing ribbon was the most difficult thing to deal with for the first few weeks but after some time with it it's easy to remember to change tabs.
 
I recall seeing a beta of 5.0 and spent 2 days writing up my thoughts and how heavy users might react.... Not sure what I can say due too signing my life away since the software is not in production but ... it only annoys the advanced users.... like us. New users don't really get effected.
 
I'll never get tired of explaining why the ribbon is so bad for personal productivity...

Starting from the implementation in Office 2007 one can see that many commands are organized in a "funny" way, and are many clicks away from the main interface. Toolbars and icons had the advantage of being SMALL and CUSTOMIZABLE so one always had the most used commands a click away and a structured menu for less used commands. With the ribbon you have the equivalent of a menu (the ribbon tabs) with a large panel switching that holds FEW non well organized commands.

The PTC implementation is even worse for two reasons: it's SLOW and it's MODAL. Being modal means that if you are in a certain tab you only have some options on your right mouse button context menu, while you naturally expect the context menu to depend ONLY on the thing you are hovering, and NOT on the status of the ribbon bar. This is confusing because you have to remember, for example, that to move a note you must be in annotation tab and things like this. The first consequence is that if you have a different workflow from what is implied by the ribbon tabs sequence, or if you are revising a drawing, you are always jumping from tab to tab, an operation that is DAMN SLOW in WF5.

If PTC wants to implement a ribbon, ok, good, but at least make it FULLY CUSTOMIZABLE (allow us also to customize the size of the bar, not only the size and place of the icons), not modal (let the right mouse button menu do its job as before) and FAST. Or at least allow the use of both toolbars and ribbon, a power user could use the ribbon and a side toolbar for most frequent used icons, and keep the ribbon minimized to gain space.

Paolo
 
mjcole_ptc said:
The WF5 interface has taken many things from other software like the ability to create ellipses that can b e sketched or rotated at an ang le other than 90deg increments.

How about allowing the creation of ellipses and hyperbolas from foci? I'd really LOVE that!

Paolo
 
I agree that the Drawing ribbon is a tad bit annoying. It seems that I have a lot of mouse travel when creating drawings just to switch tabs. If you are creating a new drawing, I think that the ribbons tabs are in a logical order, but that presumes that you complete all tasks on each tab perfectly before before switching to the next tab. I have not perfected that yet, so I find it annoying and usually I am working on an exiting drawing, or starting the drawing from a template.


I think that if we could have the ribbons switch by using the RMB menu that may help some. I would rather RMB select the tab name than travel to the ribbon to switch.


One other thing that I think would be a great addition would be in the new interruption free design (no resolve mode). When I select on the stop light to see what "failed" my natural instinct is to RMB and look for edit definition. Then I realize that it is not there and then, have to close that to go to the model tree or in the model window to get to the edit definition. I think that in the RMB in that dialog box, along with Feature Info and Reference Viewer, I would like to see edit definition or other additional options to access the "failed" feature.


Other than that, I think that I like most of the other additions that have been made to WF 5.0.


-Greg
 
(I'm writing this for PTC to read)
I don't like the new and improved (not) drawing. We can
multi-task, switch from views to dimensions to
deletes...etc. This is not an improvement.
 
The Drawing package in WF5 is what is holding us from moving forward from WF4. There a ton of features/updates in WF5 on the modeling side that we could use but the Drawing package is 3 steps backwards. having to be in the correct Column or ribbon is stupid and a huge productivity killer when we did some informal testing here. The modelin gis the fun side of things but detailing drawings is where a majority of the time is spent. If we could have WF5 drawing work/function just like WF4 then we would do it.

Edited by: jsantangelo
 
some one should remind PTC strongly that still 2D drawing is used in 90% of the places. it seems PTC just wanna see "WOW" effect on the faces of audience in Demos. PTC improves only itz modler that too for solids and it gives step mom's treatment to other modules, specially Detailing...


But any way it is having Pros n cons of its own nature. I am using Pro/E since Version 20.0. very recently v bought WF5/Creo1.0 hoping it would be more user friendly and productive.


But after going thru' i am really worried and scared. 'coz I have to train 4 guys down the line.


wish me good luck....
smiley1.gif
...
smiley19.gif
...
smiley5.gif
 
I don't like it. It adds clicks instead of making things easier.<?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" />
What worries me is that everything else will be changed to the ribbon format.


Maybe if we could create our own tab and customize it with our own icons...
 
robrific said:
What worries me is that everything else will be changed to the ribbon format.



I'm not much scared
about implementing the ribbon in other areas of the software, you know
why? Other areas, like modeling, are more fit to the ribbon
"philosophy", if it's well implemented.


You
could have a tab for basic features, a tab for edit features, a tab for
direct modeling, a tab for styling, a tab for rendering. This should
work because you rarely have to "mix" such features, when modeling you
are already in the mindframe of "now I add a protrusion", "now I add a
style feature". Everything works better because you are thinking "in
frames". But when you are detailing you move a note, then edit a
tolerance, then move a view a little bit, then you want to edit data in a
table, extract an axis, change a x-hatch, then you want to clean up
dimensions, then you edit another note, the workflow is completely
"erratic" and in the ribbon implementation this means an awful lot of
jumps between tabs.





Maybe if we could create our own tab and customize it with our own icons...



This is the graal of interface design, let people have CHOICE over the layout



Paolo
 
PTC should do a study of how a dozen power users go about
DETAILING - THEN make the ribbon bar help them to go even
faster.

This is what good interface design is about - not candy.

They should do this BEFORE foisting UIs onto the user -
its NOT what we pay maintenance for.

Im still pissed they removed the tool tip when right
click querying - boy is that a slow down.

Edited by: moriarty
 
nawaz said:
very recently v bought WF5/Creo1.0 hoping
it would be more user friendly and productive.


But after going thru' i am really worrie d and scared.
'coz I have to train 4 guys down the line.


wish me good luck....
smiley1.gif
Not to worry... You
have enough experience with WF4 to be able to do it. Else,
send them for training to some experienced trainers...You
know who.
smiley4.gif
 
For what it's worth, I was watching a WF5 webcast and they
said you can choose "out of scope" elements/dimensions by
using the "alt" key.
 
MGortner said:
you can choose "out of scope"
elements/dimensions by using the "alt" key.
Not
worth. You can only move it from one place to another. You
cannot edit the properties or perform any other operation.
 
SRINIVASANIYER1 said:
Not to worry... You
have enough experience with WF4 to be able to do it. Else,
send them for training to some experienced trainers...You
know who.
smiley4.gif





ok Srini...I know this experienced trainer. but hez out of this region now...
smiley4.gif

Edited by: nawaz
 
the drawing ribbon concept is the single worst 'upgrade' i can recall... using assembly mode in pro16 (where you had to memorize your picks) was equally intuitive


requiring the user to be in the correct tab to perform anything is just retarded, its like taking an automatic transmission in a car, and tying all the gears to a button on the dash, then requiring the driver to answer test questions before the car will shift up or down


someone mentioned having PTC let users see/run/test software before changes are released and shoved down the general publics throat... i have brought this point up with them and they swear everything is tested and reviewed and anything they release is 'proven' to be faster or better or less clicky'er


i offer thatthis couldn't be further from the truth, whoever is testing and improving drawing mode should put out to pasture
 

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