17" Macbook Pro

In case anyone is interested:

I have been running Pro/E in Windows (running natively via Boot Camp) on a new 17" Macbook Pro 2.4Ghz portable for about a week now. It runs Pro/E really well! Better than my IBM T60p. Granted, the T60p is a year old now...

In any case, I haven't had any issues with the graphics/drivers. Be sure to set the "fasthlr" config option to "yes" or hidden line views will take *forever*.

More info: I am working on a reasonably large (250 components) assembly that includes some complex surfaces. I can shade and spin the entire assembly. In wireframe mode, we noticed about a 2 second delay, after spinning, before the model becomes responsive. My friend's Dell M90 had about a 3 second delay. So it performs on a par with other mobile workstations.

And before you ask, here's why I am using a MBP:
1. The Macbook Pro is the one of the precious few laptops that supports dual-link DVI for pushing a 30" monitor. Why other mobile workstation manufacturers (I'm looking at you, Dell) haven't caught on to this is a complete mystery to me.
2. HP has a new mobile workstation that supports Dual-link DVI, but only through its dock connector. It also happens to be as expensive as the Macbook Pro, and it's thicker. Oh, and it's only offered with Vista, which Pro/E will not even run on, yet...
3. MBP - 1 inch thick, 6.8 lbs. Dell M90 - 1.6 inches thick, 8.6 lbs.

I researched online before purchasing and couldn't find anyone else who had tried the new MBP's. So I took the plunge and thought I'd share in case anyone else out there is on the fence.

Cheers,
AM

UPDATE: I am running Wildfire 2.0. Forgot to mention that in the original post.
07-0724 UPDATE: Corrected the weights and thicknesses listed above per the Dell and Apple websites.


Edited by: ameuniot

Hello All,

Well, it's been another week now and I have been doing a lot of CAD modeling. I must say that I'm very happy with the Macbook Pro. I'm out of the "try it and see" phase that I was previously in.

Now that I've had more time with the machine, here are some more observations that you may find helpful:

1. I can run the machine in dual screen mode with my external Samsung display (1600 x 1200 resolution), but I cannot make the Samsung the primary display for some reason. The display does not appear in the drop-down list. This may be a real problem for those wanting to use this type of setup. I am hoping it will be fixed with a video driver update. Running the external display as the only (and thus, primary) screen works fine.

2. There's a relatively rare, strange issue where Pro/E slows to an utter crawl. I have tried closing windows, using "Erase Not Displayed", reducing the shade quality, and turning off "Small Surfaces" and "Shade with Edges", but none of it seems to revive Pro/E. But restarting Pro/E sets it back to normal and I can crank up those video settings just fine. It has only happened twice in the last week. Again, I'm assuming a video driver issue and hoping for an update. Regardless, it isn't common enough to be a big problem. Pro/E full-on crashed more often on my old system (only a year old, mind you).

2a. Speaking of open windows, I haven't noticed any problems with having multiple (as many as 8-9) Pro/E windows open at once.

3. Speaking of crashes, Pro/E has bombed on me a couple times. But again, less often than on my prior T60p.

4. This machine runs HOT. But I remember reading something about how metal enclosures on laptops FEEL hotter even though their surface temperature may be the same as a plastic case. And they generally do a better job of transferring heat out of the enclosure, which is better for the critical components.

5. The screen on this thing rocks. I can comfortably model on it without an external display. And I'm used to a 21" UXGA external monitor. Without a doubt, go for the high resolution screen. Unless you have eyesight problems, in which case I recommend you go to an Apple Store and compare the two.

6. The bluetooth Apple Mighty Mouse works great with this machine and Pro/E. No dongle to plug in! But the buttons do not appear to be programmable with the current drivers supplied by Boot Camp.

7. The lack of a docking connector has not bothered me at all. My T60p had so many problems docking and undocking that it was more trouble than it was worth. And yes, I was using the Thinkpad "undock" command or button as instructed...

8. The biggest downside has been that Boot Camp does not provide for a true "Delete" key. The Delete key on the MBP keyboard is mapped to the Windows "Backspace" key. To hit Delete, you actually have to press fn-delete. These two buttons are at opposite ends of the keyboard and so it requires both hands. Bummer. With a different mouse (Logitech Revolution?) you could probably program one of the buttons to be a true Delete key, but then you're back to using a dongle.

Well, that's all I can think of for now. I have had clients comment on how "pretty" the machine is and after seeing Pro/E running on it, a couple of the other contractors on this project are contemplating getting one.

If anything else comes up in the following weeks, I'll post it when I can.

Cheers,
AM


Edited by: ameuniot

hi,


just to let you know, we have been running mbp 17" for 6 months or so.


Its run as a comunal/trip/visit laptop rather than someones dedicated workstation running both OSX and Vista. It was purchsed for the dualfunctioanlity ( i work in a consultancy)also dell laptop/workstations are like carrying a brick, it becomes an issue if you travel about airports a lot belieive me!


Wildfire seems to have no problems with vista, graphics arefine, rendering in pro and other programs fairly speedily;though the fn-delete button is annoying !


The only real issues we have had have been with vista working with the mac; as new boot camp drivers are coming out these are getting addressed - boot camp is a beta after all.


funnily enough it doesnt seem to like solidworks, though i beleive they are releasing a vista certified version at some point.


its good you have posted AM i should have before, when i was looking at buying the mbp i could find no informaton on ppl using proe on one and how it performed.


proe works on macbook as well - the gfx have a bit more of a hard time though (it is on board) but suitable for simple stuff i guess


bobson

Hello.
I am looking into buying a Macbook Pro & this info has been very informative. Late last year @ a Pro/E event i saw a Macbook Pro with Pro/E on it & i said to myself "that's my next laptop"

You mentioned using the Apple Mighty Mouse. Is it a 3 button mouse ? Any problems using it especially if your used to a 3 button?

Thanks

I'm impressed. I find it hard to believe but impressed.

Since the last posting to this thread was on 10/24/07, I was curious if there are any more people who are successfully (and happily) running ProE WF3/WF4 on a newer MBP, or could comment on the performance under Leopard (10.5) and newer versions of Parallels/Boot Camp loaded with XP or Vista.

My Dell M60 (work) and Apple TiPB (home) are both getting a little long in the tooth. I'd like to replace both of them with a new Apple MBP. I'd also like to leverage my existing software investment and run ProE via Parallels (or equiv VM) so I can access my existing applications concurrently (ProE, Photoshop, Acrobat, MSOffice, Dreamweaver, Flash, etc.) and don't have to waste $ and disk space loading duplicate os-native versions of the same software.

One difficult thing to rate/compare are the NVIDIA 8600M/9400M graphics cards since they are not ProE/SolidWorks certified. Any insights would be appreciated.

And I should know this but... Since OSX is 64-bit, does XP64/Vista64
work well under Parallels or Boot Camp? If it does, I might as well take
advantage of it.

Or should I wait for 10.6 (Snow Leopard) before I make the plunge into a new laptop that is designed to take better advantage of its under-the-hood and plumbing improvements?

As for ProE, I have been a user and admin of ProE full time since rev 9 and currently using WF3 to support clients in the large capital equipment/semiconductor fields and for the DOE labs. Although I often hit the limits of my M60 (yes, I know all about large assembly management), it is generally adequate for my day-to-day ProE usage. If I were to go down the route of the MBP, it would need to perform better than my M60 or close to a contemporary equivalent.

I've also been using the Mac since OS7 and Windows since WinNT, so no flame wars please. There are reasons I like and use both OS's.

Thank you in advance.


Edited by: cwelcher

i run solidworks, matlab, and i have had a trial version of rhino and pro-e
on my 15'' mbp and after almost a year, it has ran all of them noticeably
better than either an xp or vista machine. my apple even runs better than
my workstation at my office and i only have 2 gb of ram in it. i don't
know how credible this next part is, but i heard through my friend that
apples perform better than windows os, in part, because of the way they
allocate ram... (sounds reasonable)

i have vm fusion installed with bootcamp, and my only gripe is the
graphics card. it doesn't support any of the real-view textures in
solidworks, and i've had some rendering problems in pro-e. however, i
would not go back to using a windows machine, especially e-mail,
internet, general productivity software.

bottom line...
get an apple. sure it'll take a week or two to get used to, but in the long
run, you'll wonder why you ever stuck with windows.

I've been running Pro/E on an 2.16GHz Core2Duo iMac with ATI X1600 graphics for over two years now and it has been nothing but a pleasure. All my coworker's computers have big towers that take up lot of room along with all the cords running everywhere and fans all over the place making ton of racket.


Meanwhile, my iMac is sitting here completely silent (no fan noise) working on assemblies that they other computers completely choke on, taking basically no more room than a 20' monitor without computer does etc. Other than for when need slots for i/o cards, I see no reason whatsoever for anyone to have the typical box computer.


Now I just yesterday I additionally got myself a new 15" Macbook Pro with the Nvidia 9600M GT + 9400 graphics cards running together in SLI! This is as powerful as any notebook, basically, but it's still less than an inch thick. And it's build out of one big block of aluminum and just holding it you can feel its case is 10x as strong as typical notebooks. Can't wait to start using it.

Im going to try to buy a mac book pro on craigs list this month.
Edited by: design-engine

Thanks for all of your replies so far. Please keep 'em coming! You all definitely don't need to fundamentally convince me to get a Mac (I've been using one at home for over 15 years!). I was just mainly wondering if it is now a viable hardware alternative for day-to-day ProE (and SolidWorks) usage.

nissin - are the graphics issues mostly annoying and not impediments to your work using ProE/SW? Do you know if the graphics imcompatibilities are related to VMware or the card itself? Which versions of ProE and SW are you runing?

Bart - are you planning on using a VM (like Parallels or VMware) or Boot Camp?

2ms1 - Same question as to Bart - VM or Boot Camp? I'd be very interested in what results you get with the your new MBP since this is what is currently being sold. I must admit I'm not very familiar with SLI. Does it allow you to run more than one graphics card at once or somehow multithread (wrong term I'm sure) the graphics power to a single or multiple monitors? Is the external hardware small enough to be easily transported in a laptop case? If this is what I would need to get superior performance for work, it would need to be portable since I'm a consultant who works in multiple locations.

Thanks again for all of your replies! Maybe one day ProE and SW will be OSX native. One could dream...

Ive seen a port of Pro/E run on a Mac years ago.It was probably an alpha test or something.

It just breaks my heart that you guys would get a MacBook or any Apple
computer for that matter, and put Windows on it. Windows is so crappy they
have to lie and call it another name just to try and make it sell.

it was not windows back when I saw that test.

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I went and looked at 17" macbook pro laptop today. I like silver so much.

Were you still able to resist theseductive silver siren singing her hypnotic musings?